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 Alright: So...

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Should I Start Over
Yes
67%
 67% [ 2 ]
No
33%
 33% [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 3
 

AuthorMessage
Fenik




PostSubject: Alright: So...   December 27th 2010, 9:03 pm

I am kinda stuck here. I have absolutely no idea of what to do now. (I swear Coryn was my best character ever...)

I find myself bored out of my mind, no longer knowing how I will take a perfectly good Naruto Jutsu thingie, and make it into some wicked spell for this character. I feel like I need to start over.

However...

I realize that if I start over, I go right back to pre-block A. Meaning I have minimal MP, minimal spell count... minimal... well... everything. I notice that that isn't much... but still...

So I would like a vote. It will last until Wednesday around this time.

If the vote is majority 'Yes', I will then ask (On Wednesday) who wants to kill Kiyuki.
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Yuna

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Gil: 500
Home World: Spira
Maximum AP: 1000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 27th 2010, 11:26 pm

Here's a revolutionary idea.

Stop thinking about Naruto for a while.

Your biggest problem with making things to fit for this site or the previous one was that you were ALWAYS pulling from a source other than Final Fantasy, notably Naruto. Final Fantasy is not Naruto. It has a completely different outlook, a different way of approaching magic and, well, everything.

So why don't you stick with the character you have and start thinking about Final Fantasy for a while?

DON'T take Naruto Jutsus and try to turn them into FF Spells. Make FF Spells instead. DON'T try for the biggest, most wicked, most overpowering ability in the world. Your abilities won't count as much in combat as your ability to describe and your experience on Site anyway. Try to make useful but relatively minor abilities for a while.

Or simply don't make stuff for a while and focus on that most old-fashioned of RP skills, Character Development. Yeah, it's not fighting, but if you hadn't noticed, no one's doing a lot of fighting anymore anyway.

Just an idea.

Grizz

==============================


Level Group 100 -- Also answers to Grizz or Tira
High Summoner of Spira

"So, this is my life now, we travel from place to place and the days just seem to fly by... But sometimes, I find myself stopping... I'm listening for your whistle."
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Rinoa Heartilly

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Gil: 500
Home World: Balamb
Maximum AP: 2500

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 27th 2010, 11:29 pm

what Yuna said......

==============================


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Rinoa's Profile
Level 200
2000 MP/AP
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Kuja

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Gil: 500
Home World: Gaia
Maximum AP: 2000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 27th 2010, 11:39 pm

*looks up at what been said and then looks at my posting area*......I have only one thing to add..........Spells > Long hand sign combos thus Mages > Ninjas end of story. Simply put do what Yuna said before you end up getting killed because you spending too much time trying to do the hand sign combos correctly instead of dodging the large sword/axe/claw/what ever coming at your head.

That is all.

==============================


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Raven Voron

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PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 1:17 am

I'm not going to vote because if you want to start again cause you can't do anything, go ahead I've done that before. (I'll even be the the one to kill him if you want XD )

Now on to the meat of it. I disagree with Yuna for the most part, but she has really good points and she's been doing this longer than me so she's probaly more qualified to help you but...

You are obviously very interested in Naruto, so much that you copy some of the ideas from the series. Naruto is the inspiration that drives you to make your character special. So to say to ignore Naruto and focus soley on FF would kill your will to post and you would end up with a character that you don't like.

On the other hand, you can't ignore FF completly either. This is a site that is based on FF and so, has rules in place for making characters for the FF world. If you look at my character, he is just a mash of a ton of different videogames, mostly Halo and Splinter Cell, though. Neither of those games come even close to FF in story, plot, or style, but I broke my character down and did a little research. I took the basic idea of what I wanted to do with him and then compared that with things in the FF world.

Now, I made that mess of a soldier work, and even though he has some major flaws to him, I LOVE PLAYING HIM! He is exactly the kind of character I always wanted to see. And now after I've used him a whle, he has changed from that mash up into his own character that can stand on his own. Now if I can do that with what I had to work with, you could surely take the ideas you got from Naruto (which is sorta close to FF) and make it work.

Maybe the character you have was started wrong so you can't make it work. Maybe you do need to start over. I don't know what you are looking for, but what I do know is whatever you choose to do, someone here will help you with whatever you need.

Now Yuna, don't kill me for what I said. XD I loved what you said about don't worry about making the most powerful spell or weapon. You're right it isn't the weapon its how you Rp using it. Also I liked what you said about just Rping. If you just get out there and Rp, your character will start to develop.

Oh, and also what Kuja said. You really don't need the hand motions, they'll just end up getting you killed.

Raven
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Fenik




PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 1:51 am

Having taken the time to read the big posts here I see today, and by god, these are the longest persuasive arguments (meant as calmly as I can put it) I have ever let myself read.

Alright so I can agree with both Yuna and Raven.

Now what my issue is: I completely based Kiyuki on combat, so much so that I lost sight of what I was doing with him. Unlike Coryn, and my other Fenik who's name was actually Fenik, to whom I was RPing for the simple fact that it was RP, I made Kiyuki, who I tossed everything I thought was pretty cool into one load... and then failed to follow up with a decent character to match such a decent character (Which I didn't with Coryn).

I'm not implying I would bring Coryn back (no matter how much you all miss him and his Emo friend Tom and that creepy puppet guy Haruken) I am simply saying he was among my better works with an actual central theme to his character instead of what I did with 'oh that is kewl, I'll use that later'. He was a water boy, he had a big fishy sword and a gun, controlled water and that was his gig as the Commando/Ravanger. Even Thomas had a theme, my Psynergist and Sabatour, as well as the occasional Ravager, and he was an Emo.

So what I am saying is that I fatally overspecialized my character for combat, and forgot why he was created, hence why I don't RP anymore over here, hence why all my party members are more socially oriented, hence why I feel like I should start over.

Yuna, I am not completely ignoring you if that is what you think at this point. I simply find that your argument to completely cease making use of a perfectly good idea base is completely out of my reach for now. Naruto is in my opinion Final Fantasy, hopped up on steroids and forced to do handseals, while having a continuously enlarging base of OP characters, that are killed by more OP characters. Which is why I love Naruto so much, because it is simply like quite a few RPs I know of. Who can be more badass within the limits of the rules, while continuing to have a character about them that continues making friends and stuff.

Note how Coryn made you all my friends, Bebedora knocked a few out of the listings, Fenik Toriyumi made you inch close, Kiyuki makes me too confused to RP. Apparently depending on how RP successful my character is, the better I feel.

So there is my stand point.

No matter the case, I will continue using Naruto for a base of ideas to Final Fantasize. Just depending on the outcome, will determine if I can start anew or not, and find a new place in this community maybe filling the hole in my heart where Coryn left, and how I will have to go about it.

Now people, make your friggin votes. All that opinion and you don't even want to help out a fellow RPer in his decision? No matter how many posts tell me one way, if the votes say the other, I'm on the side with the people who voted. God forbid it be a tie, I'll look over the messages for help.


(Darn my fingers hurt now)
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Raven Voron

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PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 2:01 am

Well, we are going over persuasive essays in school. Maybe I can use this instead of writing another one. XD

I voted yes cause you don't seem happy with what you got. You got to be happy with the character you make or you won't use him. (I also voted yes cause I want to kill something.)
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Yuna

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Gil: 500
Home World: Spira
Maximum AP: 1000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 2:13 am

To be completely honest, Raven, you went about building your character Right. There are Right Ways and Wrong Ways to do just about anything.

If what you want is a Ninja character, there are ways to do that in FF and make it fit. Honestly, take a look at FFXI and the Elemental Wheel. It's not really possible to do here because of Elemental restrictions on character creations, but the idea of manipulating Elemental Weaknesses can work no matter what you're using. Heck, that's what Tira was doing with Dragon back on the other site *before* she became a Ninja.

As for rebuilding your character, as someone who has had to REGULARLY rewrite my characters from the ground up as events outside my control have destroyed their foundations, I KNOW what it is that I'm suggesting and it's NOT EASY. But it can be worth it. I have hit my character with the Amnesia Hammer; I have rewritten her focus, her associations, everything, and more than once. It can be done.

Heck, I'm having to do it with Yuna and she was one I never thought I'd have to revamp.

It's a matter of separating Form from Function and figuring out exactly what it is that you really want and need.

If you want help in reworking your character, we can do that.

If you want to start over, we can help you with that, too.

Ultimately, it's not something you can leave to others to decide. This is a choice you have to make yourself because you are the one who is going to have to live with the consequences. We don't have to deal with the fallout, only you do. So yours is the only voice that matters.

I actually understand Raven's point, though, about Naruto being your sole inspiration, but I also look at this from a larger standpoint. So long as you are solely imitating someone else, you will never truly learn how to create on your own. You will always be only an imitator. The secret of originality is that there is nothing new under the sun, only new ways of looking at things and new ways of putting old ideas together. To be truly original, you have to draw from as many sources as possible and you have to put them together in a way that is uniquely your own.

There are shades of Nel Zelpher in Tiraleen. But she isn't a Nel Expy. The key is to look at what you want and then separate it from what you don't really need.

There are shades of just about every child-mage and child-summoner in Mairi-chan. She's got the essence of one of my oldest Author Avatar characters, one I hadn't used in YEARS. She started from just a dollmaker image and she bounced in the back of my brain for months before Steel helped me get enough of a handle on her personality to actually work with her. Heck, he was the one who figured out that she was about 5 or so, because I was getting pictures of her from 5 to 15.

The point is to look at more than just the fancy moves you want to use and actually look into the essence of the character you're creating. You are giving voice to a person who can only speak through you. You are Speaking for a character that lives in the back of your brain. None of us can do this for you. No one else's characters will ever fit you perfectly.

Heck, I even had to look at Yuna carefully to find the parts of her that meshed with me so that we could communicate effectively.

There's a point to all this rambling, I know there is. I hope it helped.

Grizz

==============================


Level Group 100 -- Also answers to Grizz or Tira
High Summoner of Spira

"So, this is my life now, we travel from place to place and the days just seem to fly by... But sometimes, I find myself stopping... I'm listening for your whistle."
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Fenik




PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 2:28 am

I notice that you managed to flawlessly mesh together your ideas. However in the current case, I meshed together far too many ideas into one set of characters and they became something I can't RP. Simply put enough.

Of course I can draw my base ideas from other things as well... as you have seen I do have a history with such games as Persona 4 while moderately meshing it with Naruto to make Nanako/Fenik over on the other site while keeping it as close to Final Fantasy as my mind would allow it to go. I have many base ideas to which some meshing would be needed to create what I call, "a General Idea".

Sure mock my ways for limiting myself but you have seen it work. You have also witnessed how expanding my ideas improperly failed me horrendously.

I don't really want to re-work this character as I failed to make him properly, however I don't really want to start anew because of the wicked backlash from that. I sure as hell won't stop RPing. Which is why I need a kick in the ass now, which is why I want you to vote, not to decide, but to kick me in the right direction like all loving members and staff would do. (Followed by various noogies, scoffing, forms of the flu, and other forms of torture you sadistic bastards made me love about you all. lol)
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Yuna

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Gil: 500
Home World: Spira
Maximum AP: 1000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 2:38 am

Look, I've HAD an unplayable character.

What do you think happened when I had to hit Tira with the Amnesia Mallet? She completely collapsed on me and was, for all intents and purposes, DEAD. Yeah, I didn't put her in that coma as simply a story device, that was ACTUALLY her condition when the Resurrection of Gilgamesh failed.

I had built Tira from the GROUND UP on a foundation of sand and that sand was washed away. There was nothing left of her that I could work with. She was never designed to last more than a month. I was going to just fade away from the site and vanish with the hope that no one would miss me.

So your character is in a similar state. Unplayable and made that way.

So strip her down some and look at what you ACTUALLY need. You can always remove abilities, delete them from the character arsenal.

The essence of your character is a sort-of Reverse Trap. That sort of Gender Confusion can make for an interesting character device. So use that as the foundation, if you want. Or have her actually hit over the head and wake up with amnesia.

You *can* rebuild her, better, stronger, faster...

Okay, so I'll stop with the Million Dollar Man references, but it's the truth. Rebuilding is difficult, but at least give it a try before you go smashing yourself back down to page one. And it's not like I'm just talking out my backside. I've been where you are. It's not easy. But it can be worth it.

Grizz

==============================


Level Group 100 -- Also answers to Grizz or Tira
High Summoner of Spira

"So, this is my life now, we travel from place to place and the days just seem to fly by... But sometimes, I find myself stopping... I'm listening for your whistle."
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Lightning
SITE OWNER
SITE OWNER
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Gil: 500
Home World: Ivalice
Maximum AP: 3000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 3:49 am

Kuja. I will have to disagree. An individual who is nimble, quick on their feet as well as the minds--can outsmart and flank someone who has to concentrate on using a spell every time. It's what I base my character on, even though I'm technically an Elementalist. I will hardly ever use a spell. or sometimes even never use a weapon. "Ninja," as you are all referring to it as--or as I would say, an "Acrobatic," approach--is the best way to go defensively. If your timing is right, in a sense--theoretically--I believe in your physical strength and prowess (Ninja) being a dominant figure over a more magically inclined person (Mage?) Every time if the right person is actually controlling the individuals in an RP. You can take the best Mage and the best martial arts RPer and I would put money on the nimble and quick martial arts RPer every time--10/10.

That is only in theory though, seeing as you won't always live in a perfect world where physics come into play as laws.

If the guy wants a "Ninja" Character. Let him have what he wants--

==============================

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Fenik




PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 9:48 am

Yuna: First off, this Fenik is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the one over on the other site. This Fenik is called Kiyuki, has no gender confusion whatsoever, and he is just an average run of the mill character. He has a typical personality, with a typical background, with typical bullsh*t that happens to him. I don't think I really NEED any of that stuff he has. Secondly, in case you couldn't tell by now, he is Male. :/ I would gladly RP Fenik Toriyumi, who is completely separate from Kiyuki period.

In other news: I like pie.

But seriously, maybe Kiyuki COULD just need a massive revamp like Tira? I figure with what he has right now with two irreversable things: Mouth Hands and a Glove that makes random magical explosions. I figure I might as well get rid of everything else irrelivent to those, meaning I save all of those Clay Spells, flush the rest down the toilet. This would put him in a 'Ronan/Deidara' state of being where, I would need to rid him of all else to try to balance that out.

If I could manage to do all of that with something like Amnesia (which is SO cliché by the way) then maybe.... MAYBE he MIGHT work for me. Given that I work in moderation to break him back in.

So who would want to flush everything except a C-(Numeral) Spell, the Clay Pouch (which will now need to get way more clay somehow... maybe I'll enchant it IRP with a bag of holding type deal...), and the Glove of the Abyss?

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Lightning
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Gil: 500
Home World: Ivalice
Maximum AP: 3000

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 1:21 pm

Do what you want Fenik. It's The Holidays and we are about to bring in a New Year. I'm willing to let a fresh start slide this once and even a total character revamp if you do it before the first week of January is over. I'd MUCH rather you just revamp your current character than create a new one, but do what you must...

==============================

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Rinoa Heartilly

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Gil: 500
Home World: Balamb
Maximum AP: 2500

PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 6:10 pm

Fenik.... in no way was Yuna speaking of your character's history or persona.

She was speaking of the multitude of Natruto, or other game related ((not Final Fantasy)) "abilities", whether it was weapons, or spells, or other creations you would post...whether here or at the old site, that would lead to your frustrations as well as us as staff. '

You'd get frustrated at us for moderating in the Final Fantasy sense of things as we are supposed to do.

Take Morph's advice here as well as what he posted regarding the Element issue. Be creative.

All I ask is in the Final Fantasy sense of things, no matter what you decide to go with.


==============================


Siggy courtesy of Fang!

Rinoa's Profile
Level 200
2000 MP/AP
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Fenik




PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 28th 2010, 7:03 pm

Yuna wrote:
Look, I've HAD an unplayable character.

What do you think happened when I had to hit Tira with the Amnesia Mallet? She completely collapsed on me and was, for all intents and purposes, DEAD. Yeah, I didn't put her in that coma as simply a story device, that was ACTUALLY her condition when the Resurrection of Gilgamesh failed.

I had built Tira from the GROUND UP on a foundation of sand and that sand was washed away. There was nothing left of her that I could work with. She was never designed to last more than a month. I was going to just fade away from the site and vanish with the hope that no one would miss me.

So your character is in a similar state. Unplayable and made that way.

So strip her down some and look at what you ACTUALLY need. You can always remove abilities, delete them from the character arsenal.

The essence of your character is a sort-of Reverse Trap. That sort of Gender Confusion can make for an interesting character device. So use that as the foundation, if you want. Or have her actually hit over the head and wake up with amnesia.

You *can* rebuild her, better, stronger, faster...


Okay, so I'll stop with the Million Dollar Man references, but it's the truth. Rebuilding is difficult, but at least give it a try before you go smashing yourself back down to page one. And it's not like I'm just talking out my backside. I've been where you are. It's not easy. But it can be worth it.


I note a lot of 'her' in that bit as well as references to gender confusion.

But that aside. :/

I'm looking at the votes here. :/ I'll do what I will tomorrow, one way or another. :/
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Fenik




PostSubject: Re: Alright: So...   December 29th 2010, 1:06 am

(Double Post: God Forgive My Soul for this terrible sin I have commited)

There we have it... It is a vote of yes 2:1.

So start over I shall.

Raven shot Kiyuki through the skull. Very Happy

Head Shot

So now, by vote, I must replace him anew.

Forget the around this time part, nobody else was voting anyways, just trying to talk me out of it.

With this I start once again, as Nobody.
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